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	<title>Comments on: Single source floods CBC&#8217;s Access to Information office</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/</link>
	<description>The official blog of the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation</description>
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		<title>By: Mike</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8303</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jan 2008 16:10:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8303</guid>
		<description>The CBC doesn&#039;t have competitors similar to a private company. While they &#039;compete&#039; for audience and have a desire (mandate?) to affect culture, they have no need to compete for revenue. It&#039;s a lot different than Global and CTV competing. 

The beleaguered Canadian taxpayer foots the bill for the CBC.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The CBC doesn&#8217;t have competitors similar to a private company. While they &#8216;compete&#8217; for audience and have a desire (mandate?) to affect culture, they have no need to compete for revenue. It&#8217;s a lot different than Global and CTV competing. </p>
<p>The beleaguered Canadian taxpayer foots the bill for the CBC.</p>
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		<title>By: Christopher Mercer</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8297</link>
		<dc:creator>Christopher Mercer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jan 2008 02:15:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8297</guid>
		<description>Hey, he&#039;s not.  I know a company that requires IE and Adobe PDF Reader 6.0.1 or higher to get your paystubs (out sourced payroll company).  To bad I am on a Mac and can&#039;t access IE.... I never see my pay stubs because of their ignorance.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey, he&#8217;s not.  I know a company that requires IE and Adobe PDF Reader 6.0.1 or higher to get your paystubs (out sourced payroll company).  To bad I am on a Mac and can&#8217;t access IE&#8230;. I never see my pay stubs because of their ignorance.</p>
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		<title>By: todmaffin</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8296</link>
		<dc:creator>todmaffin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jan 2008 02:07:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8296</guid>
		<description>YOU&#039;RE not kidding!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>YOU&#8217;RE not kidding!</p>
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		<title>By: Kempton</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8295</link>
		<dc:creator>Kempton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 23:15:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8295</guid>
		<description>Ha ha. Corporate stupidity always amaze me. When smart engineers inside Microsoft use FireFox, one has to wonder why some company insist on using IE.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ha ha. Corporate stupidity always amaze me. When smart engineers inside Microsoft use FireFox, one has to wonder why some company insist on using IE.</p>
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		<title>By: Stinky</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8294</link>
		<dc:creator>Stinky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 22:02:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8294</guid>
		<description>IE 6 being the corporate browser should be the subject of its own investigation!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>IE 6 being the corporate browser should be the subject of its own investigation!</p>
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		<title>By: Kev</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8293</link>
		<dc:creator>Kev</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 17:16:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8293</guid>
		<description>&quot;if I was a competitor I would ask a million questions and do my best to steal every good idea the CBC ever planned. Also, I would be looking for story material.&quot;

Competitive information is exempt from ATI, I think for all Crown corporations, but definitely for the CBC. (So requests for stuff like audience research, show schedules, and probably  journalists&#039; research would be refused.) That&#039;s not to say that you couldn&#039;t infer a lot from the non-exempt information, especially budgets, but my money&#039;s still on a kook or an axe-grinder rather than a competing private broadcaster. The potential for bad publicity alone would seem to rule out them doing anything so stupid.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;if I was a competitor I would ask a million questions and do my best to steal every good idea the CBC ever planned. Also, I would be looking for story material.&#8221;</p>
<p>Competitive information is exempt from ATI, I think for all Crown corporations, but definitely for the CBC. (So requests for stuff like audience research, show schedules, and probably  journalists&#8217; research would be refused.) That&#8217;s not to say that you couldn&#8217;t infer a lot from the non-exempt information, especially budgets, but my money&#8217;s still on a kook or an axe-grinder rather than a competing private broadcaster. The potential for bad publicity alone would seem to rule out them doing anything so stupid.</p>
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		<title>By: Blog Administrator</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8290</link>
		<dc:creator>Blog Administrator</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 14:09:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8290</guid>
		<description>Hi Allan and Sunshine, for now we have to manually hyperlink any standalone URLs. There&#039;s a formatting bug in the blog&#039;s design which only affects IE6 (the CBC&#039;s official browser-of-record). 

For now, anyone can make a link themselves by using the regular A HREF tags.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Allan and Sunshine, for now we have to manually hyperlink any standalone URLs. There&#8217;s a formatting bug in the blog&#8217;s design which only affects IE6 (the CBC&#8217;s official browser-of-record). </p>
<p>For now, anyone can make a link themselves by using the regular A HREF tags.</p>
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		<title>By: Julian</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8289</link>
		<dc:creator>Julian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 05:33:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8289</guid>
		<description>Based on what corporate counsel said, I believe that the nature/subject of all ATI requests will eventually be accessible through a Government of Canada database. So this isn&#039;t true.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Based on what corporate counsel said, I believe that the nature/subject of all ATI requests will eventually be accessible through a Government of Canada database. So this isn&#8217;t true.</p>
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		<title>By: sunshine</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8287</link>
		<dc:creator>sunshine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 04:05:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8287</guid>
		<description>Allan...  I just pasted the whole link into my reponse and some magic blog admin hyperlinked it it seems.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Allan&#8230;  I just pasted the whole link into my reponse and some magic blog admin hyperlinked it it seems.</p>
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		<title>By: Geoff</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8286</link>
		<dc:creator>Geoff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 01:01:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8286</guid>
		<description>I love it.  How many were out there for blood during the Somalia Inquiry.  Any idea how many requests were made from the single source of the Commission of Inquiry?  How many were giving sympathy to DND?  Most journalists were just heaping it on.

This should not have been a surprise to the CBC that there would have been a front end load as it was finally subjected to the ATI Act.  This is part of Canada&#039;s New Government and its institutions making themselves more accountable.  Accountability and transparency costs money. 

When you are providing a competing service in the public domain then you should expect to get blasted.  As noted earlier, if I was a competitor I would ask a million questions and do my best to steal every good idea the CBC ever planned.  Also, I would be looking for story material.  (I sure hope it was Conrad Black that made the requests!)

I say give it about 90 days (if not less) and we will either have a leak or some armtwisting in the Federal Court of Canada.  I have no faith that the name of the requestor will be protected by the CBC.  It will be leaked.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love it.  How many were out there for blood during the Somalia Inquiry.  Any idea how many requests were made from the single source of the Commission of Inquiry?  How many were giving sympathy to DND?  Most journalists were just heaping it on.</p>
<p>This should not have been a surprise to the CBC that there would have been a front end load as it was finally subjected to the ATI Act.  This is part of Canada&#8217;s New Government and its institutions making themselves more accountable.  Accountability and transparency costs money. </p>
<p>When you are providing a competing service in the public domain then you should expect to get blasted.  As noted earlier, if I was a competitor I would ask a million questions and do my best to steal every good idea the CBC ever planned.  Also, I would be looking for story material.  (I sure hope it was Conrad Black that made the requests!)</p>
<p>I say give it about 90 days (if not less) and we will either have a leak or some armtwisting in the Federal Court of Canada.  I have no faith that the name of the requestor will be protected by the CBC.  It will be leaked.</p>
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		<title>By: Christopher Mercer</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8285</link>
		<dc:creator>Christopher Mercer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 00:59:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8285</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t believe they exist but that does not mean they can&#039;t and won&#039;t.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t believe they exist but that does not mean they can&#8217;t and won&#8217;t.</p>
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		<title>By: Turnip</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8282</link>
		<dc:creator>Turnip</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jan 2008 22:09:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8282</guid>
		<description>Not my tax dollars, but my corporate revenue dollars... don&#039;t tell me there aren&#039;t other broadcasters out there that profit when CBC falters. We saw it during the lockout, among other times, and the reverse may be true during the writers strike. 

I&#039;m not sure any board of directors could justify such a move, but do what Kempton calls &quot;black box operations&quot; exist in commercial media? It&#039;s possible.

I&#039;m not even sure what qualifies as immoral in such an environment. Did anyone bid on the Olympics or NHL (or Desperate Housewives) simply to drive up the price? We&#039;ll never know. 

I just think that if I were a private broadcaster who could pay a nominal fee to poke my nose in the private business of one (and ONLY one) of my competitors - and have it cost them more money than it cost me! - I&#039;d have a rollicking good time doing so.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not my tax dollars, but my corporate revenue dollars&#8230; don&#8217;t tell me there aren&#8217;t other broadcasters out there that profit when CBC falters. We saw it during the lockout, among other times, and the reverse may be true during the writers strike. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m not sure any board of directors could justify such a move, but do what Kempton calls &#8220;black box operations&#8221; exist in commercial media? It&#8217;s possible.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not even sure what qualifies as immoral in such an environment. Did anyone bid on the Olympics or NHL (or Desperate Housewives) simply to drive up the price? We&#8217;ll never know. </p>
<p>I just think that if I were a private broadcaster who could pay a nominal fee to poke my nose in the private business of one (and ONLY one) of my competitors &#8211; and have it cost them more money than it cost me! &#8211; I&#8217;d have a rollicking good time doing so.</p>
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		<title>By: Turnip</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8281</link>
		<dc:creator>Turnip</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jan 2008 21:31:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8281</guid>
		<description>Anyone know if such measures exist right now in CBC&#039;s case? If so, how many requests would be considered &quot;abuse&quot;? (obviously more than 450...) I wonder if there&#039;s any way to determine intent, if that&#039;s relevant.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anyone know if such measures exist right now in CBC&#8217;s case? If so, how many requests would be considered &#8220;abuse&#8221;? (obviously more than 450&#8230;) I wonder if there&#8217;s any way to determine intent, if that&#8217;s relevant.</p>
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		<title>By: Kempton</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8275</link>
		<dc:creator>Kempton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jan 2008 17:50:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8275</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the section 9(1)(a) reference. And the &quot;giving notice&quot; provisions. plus &quot;...notice shall contain a statement that the person has a right to make a complaint to the Information Commissioner about the extension.&quot;

Looks good to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the section 9(1)(a) reference. And the &#8220;giving notice&#8221; provisions. plus &#8220;&#8230;notice shall contain a statement that the person has a right to make a complaint to the Information Commissioner about the extension.&#8221;</p>
<p>Looks good to me.</p>
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		<title>By: Christopher Mercer</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8274</link>
		<dc:creator>Christopher Mercer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jan 2008 12:41:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8274</guid>
		<description>Turnip,

The situation you describe is easily fixed.  Even the judicial system has ways to deal with abusers and the powers that be can easily introduce measures to prevent abuse if necessary.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Turnip,</p>
<p>The situation you describe is easily fixed.  Even the judicial system has ways to deal with abusers and the powers that be can easily introduce measures to prevent abuse if necessary.</p>
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		<title>By: Kempton</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8273</link>
		<dc:creator>Kempton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jan 2008 06:51:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8273</guid>
		<description>ATI is a powerful tool, if it takes a **potential abuse** (that cost $$) in the beginning to have a long term working ATI, I will gladly pay the price to create a system that can have a long term check and balance against some black box operations.

The idea that something can be &quot;ATI-ed&quot; should already put some senior CBC executives on alert to do their jobs in a responsible manner. (not that I am implying they are not doing it already)

Of course, there are some CBC executives who will always be more interested in covering their asses. And that is also part of the price to pay and we will just have to sort out those and try to ensure they are not operating above rules and laws.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ATI is a powerful tool, if it takes a **potential abuse** (that cost $$) in the beginning to have a long term working ATI, I will gladly pay the price to create a system that can have a long term check and balance against some black box operations.</p>
<p>The idea that something can be &#8220;ATI-ed&#8221; should already put some senior CBC executives on alert to do their jobs in a responsible manner. (not that I am implying they are not doing it already)</p>
<p>Of course, there are some CBC executives who will always be more interested in covering their asses. And that is also part of the price to pay and we will just have to sort out those and try to ensure they are not operating above rules and laws.</p>
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		<title>By: todmaffin</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8272</link>
		<dc:creator>todmaffin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jan 2008 06:18:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8272</guid>
		<description>Well, THAT&#039;S a responsible use of your own tax dollars! 
:-(</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, THAT&#8217;S a responsible use of your own tax dollars!<br />
 <img src='http://www.insidethecbc.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_sad.gif' alt=':-(' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Allan</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8271</link>
		<dc:creator>Allan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jan 2008 21:47:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8271</guid>
		<description>It costs more than $5 to file a request, just try it.
More than 3 months later and I&#039;m still waiting to get a response from the Ottawa office.
Will it cost me another $5 find out why my query has gone unanswered?
Hey &quot;sunshine&quot;, how did you create that link in your comment?
Is everyone able to do that?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It costs more than $5 to file a request, just try it.<br />
More than 3 months later and I&#8217;m still waiting to get a response from the Ottawa office.<br />
Will it cost me another $5 find out why my query has gone unanswered?<br />
Hey &#8220;sunshine&#8221;, how did you create that link in your comment?<br />
Is everyone able to do that?</p>
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		<title>By: Turnip</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8258</link>
		<dc:creator>Turnip</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jan 2008 15:23:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8258</guid>
		<description>If I were one of CBC&#039;s competitors, which are not subject to ATI, I&#039;d be filing more than 450 - I&#039;d keep them coming endlessly. If it costs $5 to file, and probably $100 in person hours to answer, I&#039;d set aside a couple of million and throw the CBC into serious financial turmoil. Good business.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If I were one of CBC&#8217;s competitors, which are not subject to ATI, I&#8217;d be filing more than 450 &#8211; I&#8217;d keep them coming endlessly. If it costs $5 to file, and probably $100 in person hours to answer, I&#8217;d set aside a couple of million and throw the CBC into serious financial turmoil. Good business.</p>
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		<title>By: iNudes</title>
		<link>http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood/comment-page-1/#comment-8256</link>
		<dc:creator>iNudes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jan 2008 14:53:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.insidethecbc.com/atiflood#comment-8256</guid>
		<description>If you look at the whole law (see below) there are options for the corp to extend its time limits.  I think since thye are new to this it is not unexpected that there are some extra delays.  They set up based on the volume of requests received by other departments and by the BBC when they first came under similar rules.  One person flooded them with requests, so taking more than 30 days to give out the info is not unreasonable.

Extension of time limits

9. (1) The head of a government institution may extend the time limit set out in section 7 or subsection 8(1) in respect of a request under this Act for a reasonable period of time, having regard to the circumstances, if 

(a) the request is for a large number of records or necessitates a search through a large number of records and meeting the original time limit would unreasonably interfere with the operations of the government institution,

(b) consultations are necessary to comply with the request that cannot reasonably be completed within the original time limit, or

(c) notice of the request is given pursuant to subsection 27(1)

by giving notice of the extension and, in the circumstances set out in paragraph (a) or (b), the length of the extension, to the person who made the request within thirty days after the request is received, which notice shall contain a statement that the person has a right to make a complaint to the Information Commissioner about the extension.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you look at the whole law (see below) there are options for the corp to extend its time limits.  I think since thye are new to this it is not unexpected that there are some extra delays.  They set up based on the volume of requests received by other departments and by the BBC when they first came under similar rules.  One person flooded them with requests, so taking more than 30 days to give out the info is not unreasonable.</p>
<p>Extension of time limits</p>
<p>9. (1) The head of a government institution may extend the time limit set out in section 7 or subsection 8(1) in respect of a request under this Act for a reasonable period of time, having regard to the circumstances, if </p>
<p>(a) the request is for a large number of records or necessitates a search through a large number of records and meeting the original time limit would unreasonably interfere with the operations of the government institution,</p>
<p>(b) consultations are necessary to comply with the request that cannot reasonably be completed within the original time limit, or</p>
<p>(c) notice of the request is given pursuant to subsection 27(1)</p>
<p>by giving notice of the extension and, in the circumstances set out in paragraph (a) or (b), the length of the extension, to the person who made the request within thirty days after the request is received, which notice shall contain a statement that the person has a right to make a complaint to the Information Commissioner about the extension.</p>
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